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Simon
06-14-2003, 05:55 PM
Hi

Ok here you can add comments about the new members area tools, etc, suggestions, and feedback.

In case you didn't notice hwo to get to it, just click on the big flashing yellow button at the top of the page.

Cheers
Simon

Steve
06-25-2003, 03:36 AM
I have had great satisfaction with DPS Nutrition. I often find they have the best prices on name-brand supp's after cross-checking them with several other online dealers that I know have lower prices than others. I have never had a problem with an order there.

Steve

Simon
06-25-2003, 06:00 PM
OK Steve, if we get a couple more thumbs up we will add them
Thanks
Simon

Steve
06-26-2003, 12:04 AM
Originally posted by SIMES
OK Steve, if we get a couple more thumbs up we will add them
Thanks
Simon

Cool.:cool:

Kimbah
07-02-2003, 07:22 AM
Love the new members area!

But I've got a couple of minor technical problems with the E-Book update section.

Firstly, there's no "print button" for the new updated Creatine Review.

Also, I can't get any of the exercise demo videos to play with Windows Media Player - I think this is a problem with the site, as I don't usually have any problems playing these on my PC.

Also, I thought maybe I needed the Quicktime 4 plug-in (which I was pretty sure I already had), but when I clicked on the link it took me to a "not found" page.

Help!

Cheers,
Kimbah

Simon
07-02-2003, 09:52 AM
Originally posted by Kimbah
Love the new members area!

But I've got a couple of minor technical problems with the E-Book update section.

Firstly, there's no "print button" for the new updated Creatine Review.

Also, I can't get any of the exercise demo videos to play with Windows Media Player - I think this is a problem with the site, as I don't usually have any problems playing these on my PC.

Also, I thought maybe I needed the Quicktime 4 plug-in (which I was pretty sure I already had), but when I clicked on the link it took me to a "not found" page.

Help!

Cheers,
Kimbah

HI Kimbah

Thanks for all the heads ups, your like my proof reader.

Ok, I've added a creatine print option, so that's all working now
The exercise vids only play with Quicktime not windows real player so I've made that clearer on the site now
The link now works to downlload the free quicktime player, dimwits at Apple changed their download link

Thanks again , all should be fine for you now, it's worth downloading quicktime, the videos on the site are pretty good.

Simon

GEORGE-GREEK
07-02-2003, 03:14 PM
Hi Will,

Isn't there any meal and calorie planner for losing bodyfat in the new site?

Devildog
07-02-2003, 04:23 PM
You can adjust the meal planner for losing bodyfat by selecting option 'c' or 'd' for what bodytype you are. Pick 'c' if you need to cut up a little bit or 'd' if you need to lose a lot of fat. It will automatically adjust the daily calories and break it down for you per meal.

michael

Simon
07-03-2003, 09:27 AM
Originally posted by Devildog
You can adjust the meal planner for losing bodyfat by selecting option 'c' or 'd' for what bodytype you are. Pick 'c' if you need to cut up a little bit or 'd' if you need to lose a lot of fat. It will automatically adjust the daily calories and break it down for you per meal.

michael

Good advice Michael, I would just like to add, that I would opt specifically for option 'D' and don't include option 'C', you would struggle to lose weight depending on many factors with option 'C'

I wrote the calcualtor so I am in reasonable position to comment.

I would also pay very careful consderation to the 'Calorie Variator' option at the bottom. The meal planner was never really designed for weight loss, the macronutrient rations are not idea for weight loss by a long stretch.

If your still gaining, I suggest using the calorie variator to modify your intake.

If your a customer of Will's other ebook, Diet Supplements Revealed, we will have the new members are open there very soon, and that does have a weight loss meal planner calcualtor based on the guidless in that ebook which is for fat loss whilist retaining LBM

I have to say that this calc is really not designed from a macronutrient or calorie perspective to achieve what you want.

I may think about adding some kind of option like that in the future.

Simon

Bear
07-12-2003, 01:27 AM
Simes, I couldn't get to the link you sent me about the live chat but count me in. I think it would be a great thing to have. You would have to post a schedule as to when and who etc, but two thumbs up here.

Simon
07-12-2003, 08:15 AM
Originally posted by Bear
Simes, I couldn't get to the link you sent me about the live chat but count me in. I think it would be a great thing to have. You would have to post a schedule as to when and who etc, but two thumbs up here.

HI Bear

The URL probably broke over two lines in your email program that's all.

The thread is here:
http://www.bodybuildingrevealed.com/members/board/showthread.php?=1071e3b34e85bde348a592f5d8abb111&threadid=539

Simes

NikHUM
07-28-2003, 01:06 AM
This site just keeps getting better and better!!

Simon
07-28-2003, 09:45 AM
Originally posted by NikHUM
This site just keeps getting better and better!!

Thanks Nikum, I am trying to bring as many features as possible to our members. If anyone has any ideas for anything , irrelvant of how hard they may seem, I am all ears...

Simon

WillBrink
07-28-2003, 02:54 PM
Originally posted by GEORGE-GREEK
Hi Will,

Isn't there any meal and calorie planner for losing bodyfat in the new site?

You would simply choose a different calorie value based on the ebooks calorie recommendations for weight gain or weight loss. However, as it says in the ebook, I would not consider the MBN diet on lower calories for fat loss as an optimal WOE for fat loss. That's why I had to do two different ebooks. It's really a different structure with Pro, Carb, Fat, amounts, ratios, calculations, etc being quite different.

jwsplatjw
08-08-2003, 09:33 PM
What would be really good would be to incorporate an actual menu/shopping list generator.

Simon
08-09-2003, 10:24 AM
Originally posted by jwsplatjw
What would be really good would be to incorporate an actual menu/shopping list generator.

Yes, I agree, well more of a 'Sample Meal Plan, so it actually prints out a list of meals based on you kcals.

I had the programmers look at this but the problem was the insane variations associated with it.

I think this is why nobody else has touched this concept anywhere else. It's just to hard to put into practise.

PatS
08-09-2003, 12:28 PM
I really donít see how that could realistically be done anyway. While you could come up with a baseline meal plan the individual variations would be endless. Iíve seen other sites where they just list different sample meal plans based on certain goals. But I have yet to see anything that I could just use. Honestly I wouldnít really want to either. I think the better approach is to take the calorie and macronutrient numbers and make them fit to a persons individual dietary need. I do better with certain foods and do horrible on foods that another person would thrive on. How could you program that? I believe that research in this are is required by each of us. A certain amount of commitment is required. You would have a better understanding as to how you as an individual would react to different nutrients.

PatS.

WillBrink
08-09-2003, 02:38 PM
Originally posted by PatS
I really donít see how that could realistically be done anyway. While you could come up with a baseline meal plan the individual variations would be endless. Iíve seen other sites where they just list different sample meal plans based on certain goals. But I have yet to see anything that I could just use. Honestly I wouldnít really want to either. I think the better approach is to take the calorie and macronutrient numbers and make them fit to a persons individual dietary need. I do better with certain foods and do horrible on foods that another person would thrive on. How could you program that? I believe that research in this are is required by each of us. A certain amount of commitment is required. You would have a better understanding as to how you as an individual would react to different nutrients.

PatS.

I am no programmer but I can see right off that such an idea, though a good one, would take a team the size of the pentagon to do something like that considering the number of variables.

Simon
08-09-2003, 02:47 PM
Originally posted by PatS
I really donít see how that could realistically be done anyway. While you could come up with a baseline meal plan the individual variations would be endless. Iíve seen other sites where they just list different sample meal plans based on certain goals. But I have yet to see anything that I could just use. Honestly I wouldnít really want to either. I think the better approach is to take the calorie and macronutrient numbers and make them fit to a persons individual dietary need. I do better with certain foods and do horrible on foods that another person would thrive on. How could you program that? I believe that research in this are is required by each of us. A certain amount of commitment is required. You would have a better understanding as to how you as an individual would react to different nutrients.

PatS.

It wouldn't be perfect thats for sure, but what I had worked on was putting around 80 different staple food types into a database.

The DB would know that

50 grams oatmeal = 5protein, 30carbs 4 fat
100 grams salmon = 25 g protein, 2 g carbs 20g fat
And so forth..

The DB would know that Meal 1 = Breakfast, so for instance it would know not to apportion steak and baked potatoes for breakfast.
So I would tell the programmers to only include certain foods in the fields for Meal 1, Meal 2 and so forth..

Then say for instance each meal for subject a was

Protein 20 , Carbs 40, fat 15

It would choose an item from catagory (a) for instance which included the protein source, one item from catagory (b) the carb source and so forth.

It knows that 50 grams of oatmeal = 30g carbs, so therfore could calculate that if subject (a) needed 60 grams of carbs they would have 100grams oatmeal

And so forth, so that part of the equation although horrible could be acheived with some major fields/catagory and database planning..

However then you have all the variables, lets say subject (a) requires xxx ml of milk on his x grams of oatmeal,

When I put the whole concept down on paper, and sent it to the programmers they were quite upbeat, then days later I heard nothing so I went back to them, and it was like 'umm, err' well you see' errr;

That's about the sum of it, it is possible, but the work and cost would be insance which is exactly why nobody has created a dynamic meal planner.

Sure we can easily create diets for 2000kcals, 25000kcals, 3000kcals etc based on the MBN macronurtient splits, and then have alternatives for each meal and so forth and just display them in the members area and I am quite tempted to do that, but anything dynamic is a headache of monumental proportions.


Si

PatS
08-09-2003, 02:54 PM
Originally posted by SIMES
Sure we can easily create diets for 2000kcals, 25000kcals, 3000kcals etc based on the MBN macronurtient splits, and then have alternatives for each meal and so forth and just display them in the members area and I am quite tempted to do that, but anything dynamic is a headache of monumental proportions.


Si

This might be handy for some and itís what Iíve seen done. A lot of people donít have their diet dialed in yet and could use something to use as a baseline. They could tune it once they got started maybe?

ďWhat to eatĒ is a question I get asked a lot. Even though they have read the info, talked to the right people, some have problems figuring out where to start. Since this is a never ending process having a place to start might be a good idea.

PatS.

jwsplatjw
08-09-2003, 07:58 PM
Sure it's possible, and economical.

1) Take a stock meal analyzer engine
2) Add the ability to insert receipes
3) Ask user to create a list of "favorite" foods This list would allow the user to pick foods from the data base as well as receipes, either user input or group input (shared)
4) Engine would then take the number of meals, ratio of fpc and total kcal requirements and make several attempts to create a menu.
5) Refinement 5a) The user could specify that they do not want to buy one of items i.e. 1 bannana or 1/2 an apple etc. 5b) if fractions of foods are called out in one meal the next meal would have to consume the other half. 5c) Once the menu has been generated and the shopping list created the user could then ask the software to compare the list to items already in inventory and produce a differential list. 5d) If for example the generator has one eating someting quite expensive multiple times the user could limit items frequency per week. This would also allow for say "treat" items to be added occasonally. 5e) The user could also ask for particular items to be added or subtracted from a particular day to a) roller coaster the kcals or b) you know you are going on a buisiness lunch and would like to make accomodation for this.

Now some will likely say that this task is still impossiblw and they will be absolutly incorrect. I used to own a soft ware that did the above but in one of my manny moves I lost it and can not find it on the net again. What skills are required are some VB and an intimate understanding of relational databases, I do not possess either of these skills. There are people that do. The question is finding them and putting them to the task. Will it sell absolutly especially if one can add to the database. The Canadian government freely gives out the Canada food guide database and I would assume the yanks would do the same.

James

jwsplatjw
08-12-2003, 12:58 AM
I found a software that will do this. I am waiting to get a demo before I go and publish the www will keep you posted.

James

Simon
08-12-2003, 09:18 AM
Originally posted by jwsplatjw
I found a software that will do this. I am waiting to get a demo before I go and publish the www will keep you posted.

James

Ok, but I think we have a failire to comunicate. I misread your original post. I am not interested in having a shopping list system, but would be very interested in a system that could mirror the results that come from the calorie and meal planner in the members area and then correlated that to actual meals.

jwsplatjw
08-13-2003, 02:06 AM
This is what I'm in search of too! I do beleive this tool will allow custom meal planning and will generate a menu based on user inputs.

James

Hispie
09-03-2003, 01:54 PM
I'm not sure if this has been asked, or if this would even be the appropriate "thread" to discuss it or not - either way....,

The meal planner kicks ass - but being that I am not much in the chef department - I am left with very little variety in my diet. Is there a website with another "calculator" that would allow you to put in your nutritional requirements (ie 250g of protein, 10g of fat), and have it spit out a series of recipies? Or

I don't know if this is something that could be easily done, or has been done before (I can't imagine it isn't out on the internet somewhere). But I think it would be an INCREDIBLE add-on to the meal planner.

Is this something anyone else would like to see? Can I find something similar to this elsewhere (and I am aware of the FDA Nutritional Database, etc...)
Any feedback?

-H

Simon
09-03-2003, 03:04 PM
Originally posted by Hispie
I'm not sure if this has been asked, or if this would even be the appropriate "thread" to discuss it or not - either way....,

The meal planner kicks ass - but being that I am not much in the chef department - I am left with very little variety in my diet. Is there a website with another "calculator" that would allow you to put in your nutritional requirements (ie 250g of protein, 10g of fat), and have it spit out a series of recipies? Or

I don't know if this is something that could be easily done, or has been done before (I can't imagine it isn't out on the internet somewhere). But I think it would be an INCREDIBLE add-on to the meal planner.

Is this something anyone else would like to see? Can I find something similar to this elsewhere (and I am aware of the FDA Nutritional Database, etc...)
Any feedback?


We wish, this has been a topic for deabte for some time, currently no such software seems to be available, I have looked at trying to get this done but all the programmers I talked to run a mile.

Somebody else onthis forum was looking into it, as they beleived they had a way to do it, but have not heard back from them.

It would be an incredible add on, and I would be happy to pay for it to be done if somebody could flippen do it



-H

Hispie
09-03-2003, 04:09 PM
Damn - that sucks. There are no "affiliates" out there who are nutritionists eh? Hmm...oh well.

Here's to dreamin'!

:D
-H

Hispie
09-03-2003, 04:14 PM
James,

Did you ever find this software you were looking at on the internet?

I would be interested in seeing what software you were evaluating. As it would be INCREDIBLE to try and put something together like the recipie planner.

-H

mdwchang
09-03-2003, 09:09 PM
I'm a programmer myself... Although this kind of programming is not my particular area of expertise, I do specialize a bit in project design, and the reason why it doesn't seem anyone has implemented this, is that there are just way too many variables. It's definitely possible, but would take a lot of time (and $$$) to make it really useful.

The reason is unless you can specify a whole bunch of parameters to get recipes you actually want and what you want your plan to be like, you will probably be dissatisfied with the results. (Unless you want the thing to spit out 6 protein shakes plus oatmeal).

Everyone is very particular about their diet... For example:
- "I want my meals to be low GI except my 4th meal which should be high GI"
- "I hate carrots, so no recipes with carrots"
- "My cooking skills are limited to microwaving and using a blender"
- "I don't have time to cook my 2nd and 4th meals on the spot, so they have to be pre-preparable"
- "I eat 6 meals a day except on workout days which are 7 a day"
- "I must have broccoli-something every day"
- "I am allergic to fish oil and chicken breasts"
- "I want 80% of my food to come from whole foods"
etc. etc. etc.

Especially when training, your diet may change on a regular basis depending on what kind of phase you are in. My point is, just to get something like this functional would be a whole lot of work, and for it to be really useful would require a ton more...

Alternatively though... something that would be easier to implement, and maybe almost nearly as useful is a program that suggests recipes that fit with a type of meal you are looking for. For instance, say I want a meal that's around 30g protein, 20g carbs, 10g fat, keeping sat. fats to a minimum and the carbs being low GI... then the program would spit out a list of the best matches. Kind of like a search engine. I'll bet you could find a programmer who'd be able to do that for you...

Hispie
09-03-2003, 09:15 PM
I couldn't agree more. If we could find a way to even implement that - it would be incredible. If you look at the meal planning calculator - it really only gives you break down by fat/protein/carb, and total caloric requirement.

If there was a way to pump out even basic recipies which would adhere to the protien/fat/carb needs - and to address the minor caloric differences includes add-ons for the meals(glass of milk, bananna, side of yams, bowl of oatmeal...etc..) - I think that would be an AMAZING ADDITION.

Does anyone else agree? Know anyone who would do it? I know Simon has looked into it...and has tried to find programmers.....

-H:confused:

mdwchang
09-03-2003, 09:21 PM
Ah, didn't see this thread at first, and replied to the other related one. Like I was saying in the other thread, something like this may be possible, but it might not be useful.

Will, if people are having difficulties on where to start on the diets, how about this --

Currently, the Meal/Calorie Planner gives you your daily breakdown of meal splits. You could take one sample meal, and then try to suggest recipes that fit that macronutrient profile. For instance:

------------------
Sample Meal Result: 30g P, 15g C, 10g F

Possible recipe matches for this meal:
- 1 serving of Chicken Casserole: 33g P, 18g C, 8g F
- 2 servings of John's Homemade MRP: 30g P, 13g C, 2g F
- etc....
----------------

Each match would link to the recipe. And to make this doubly useful, instead of having us post recipes as a bulletin board post, have a recipe post area where we fill out a form, so that those can be added to the database.

Hispie
09-03-2003, 09:27 PM
That is a GREAT idea - having us put recipies in a form with a dialouge box for the instructions on how to make it. GREAT IDEA.

The nice part is - the more people put in thier own recipies, the greater database of appropriate recipies will be developed. In the long run, starting with something basic (as discussed), and allowing it to be "updated" or added to, would make for an incredible resource. The question is, how feasibly, economically could that be developed.

But Hell, I'll sit down with a cookbook and enter recipies and all thier nutritional info - if this program will help me do what I need to do.

You've got my full support!
-H

Simon
09-03-2003, 09:30 PM
Originally posted by mdwchang
I'm a programmer myself... Although this kind of programming is not my particular area of expertise, I do specialize a bit in project design, and the reason why it doesn't seem anyone has implemented this, is that there are just way too many variables. It's definitely possible, but would take a lot of time (and $$$) to make it really useful.

The reason is unless you can specify a whole bunch of parameters to get recipes you actually want and what you want your plan to be like, you will probably be dissatisfied with the results. (Unless you want the thing to spit out 6 protein shakes plus oatmeal).

Everyone is very particular about their diet... For example:
- "I want my meals to be low GI except my 4th meal which should be high GI"
- "I hate carrots, so no recipes with carrots"
- "My cooking skills are limited to microwaving and using a blender"
- "I don't have time to cook my 2nd and 4th meals on the spot, so they have to be pre-preparable"
- "I eat 6 meals a day except on workout days which are 7 a day"
- "I must have broccoli-something every day"
- "I am allergic to fish oil and chicken breasts"
- "I want 80% of my food to come from whole foods"
etc. etc. etc.

Especially when training, your diet may change on a regular basis depending on what kind of phase you are in. My point is, just to get something like this functional would be a whole lot of work, and for it to be really useful would require a ton more...

Alternatively though... something that would be easier to implement, and maybe almost nearly as useful is a program that suggests recipes that fit with a type of meal you are looking for. For instance, say I want a meal that's around 30g protein, 20g carbs, 10g fat, keeping sat. fats to a minimum and the carbs being low GI... then the program would spit out a list of the best matches. Kind of like a search engine. I'll bet you could find a programmer who'd be able to do that for you...

All the above are good points and there are even additional variables over and above that.

I don't want to spend to much time on this, BUT, I think we can simplfy it to be on these lines

Person runs the calorie planner, it tells them they need

x g of protein per meal, x g of fat and x g of carbs

We then have a basic db set up with groupings/catagories for
a) Breakfasts
b) Shakes
c) Lunch
d) Dinner

Reason being we really don't want it to spit out steak and baked potatoe for our 7am meal so we make some basic catagorisations

Then we let the system know that

x grams of lean chicken breast = protein30g, carbs0g, fat 2g

So it therfore knows that if the meal is going to be

Chicken
Rice
Veg

That to get to x g of protein it needs x g of chicken
to get to x g of carbs it needs a combination of x g of rice and x g o veg whilist simultaneoulsy factoring in that eeven veg contains protein etc

I am not ssaying it can't be done, but it's a bloody pain in the ass .

I am currently writing a really detailed project brief to hawk around to a few serious programmers, I will shell out like $1000 or so if somebody can do it, as I think it would benefit our members, but I do think it's one hell of a pain in the ass and very hard to accomplish to make it churn out sensible serios meals

For instance it would also need to understand not to mix unsavouries,

For instance if as it's protein source it added Rice as the carb, would you want to eat steak with it? probably not , more like a backed potatoe, etc

If we have protein powder in the shake, we don't want a baked potatoe as the carb source!

There's a lot of grouping and catagories to be looked at, I think it can be done, but somebody find me somebody who can handle it and I am waiting with my wallet open

Simon
09-03-2003, 09:33 PM
Originally posted by mdwchang
Ah, didn't see this thread at first, and replied to the other related one. Like I was saying in the other thread, something like this may be possible, but it might not be useful.

Will, if people are having difficulties on where to start on the diets, how about this --

Currently, the Meal/Calorie Planner gives you your daily breakdown of meal splits. You could take one sample meal, and then try to suggest recipes that fit that macronutrient profile. For instance:

------------------
Sample Meal Result: 30g P, 15g C, 10g F

Possible recipe matches for this meal:
- 1 serving of Chicken Casserole: 33g P, 18g C, 8g F
- 2 servings of John's Homemade MRP: 30g P, 13g C, 2g F
- etc....
----------------

Each match would link to the recipe. And to make this doubly useful, instead of having us post recipes as a bulletin board post, have a recipe post area where we fill out a form, so that those can be added to the database.

Yes, that's another variation on a theme, problem is that that those protine, carb fat ratios per meal will be different for nearly every single person, depending on bodyweight, and bodytype

So we would end up with things like

-1.47634 serving(s) of JOhns Chicken Casserole

if you did it the other way so that the recipe had to match exactly the macronutrient split you would have to have like thousands of recipes to hope to hit one on the nail each time to match a specific persons requirements.


It's another good idea, but there are loopholes, that need some major work

mdwchang
09-03-2003, 09:48 PM
Yeah, I think this is where it's important to examine what people really need. My suggestion is really for best matches, not exact matches. In reality, we don't look for exact matches when, for instance, we buy MRP's. We look for something close, and then make the needed adjustments.

And I agree, 1.534 servings sounds ridiculous. Just have the program only evaluate whole numbers of servings (or down to half servings).

The main thing is, I want to find a meal... ANY meal, that matches at least somewhat with my split. I can fudge or adjust the rest. I guess my point is that trying to find good recipes that match a particular meal profile is easier than trying to find a set of good recipes that matches an entire meal plan. It also would be reassuring for a beginner to try a meal that another experienced person uses as part of their regimen.

Hispie
09-03-2003, 09:50 PM
I think I might have a somewhat "bastardized" idea on how this could be solved with a little thought, and not much technological savvy at all...

I am trying to form it into a cohesive idea....will be back soon with that attempt...

mdwchang
09-03-2003, 09:52 PM
My recommendation is not to put ingredients in the database but actual recipes, since like you said Simes, I don't want to eat a baked potato with my chocolate shake.

I like your idea of categorization... the more information the recipe provides when it is inputted, the less work the program has to do to "figure out" what is appropriate (and the less money you would need to shell out for an implementation).

One programming project tip if I may add -- I wouldn't try to hire out a complex project like this in one large implementation with a lot of money... but try a basic implementation and get feedback. Then you can spend more money later on and avoid having features that people don't really need or find useful.

jwsplatjw
09-03-2003, 10:42 PM
This software is not IDEAL but is OK. It can be found at
h t t p : / / w w w . b e t b y t e . c o m /
It is free, it has both the US and Canadian databases, you can add to the database library and best of all you can put in recipies. The free version will allow only 12 recipies but this is enough to give it a try. I agree with Simon, however, it is tough to tailor each meal for each individual. What I have found useful is to get a recipie that I enjoy, plug it into the software, get the macronutrient breakdown, tweak it (if possible) to fit into my plan and use the bill of materials list to go shopping. This is not perfect but I do not beleive the intent is for us to eat exactly the same fraction of daily nutrition at each sitting. For example, you just love lasgana (sp?), you crank it in and find that for example the fat is higher than your 1/6th daily ratio. Just adjust the other meals to accomodate it. Even if it means that your kcals are out for the day make up for it the next. The idea, atleast for me, is to have a tool that will help in the planning department. Also will help if others on the list use the same software as it will facilitate recipie sharing. Just to be clear though, I do not sell this software, I found it doing a net search and thought it was decent. The package that I really wanted to try out did not respond to my manny requests for a demo version. My research continues, if I find another winner I will pass it along.

James

Hispie
09-03-2003, 10:57 PM
This is why I suggest the following: it is not the caloric values/age/or weight that is this issue.

The major determinant for the recipies is twofold:
1)is the ratio's between protien/carb and fats as compared with total calories.
2) How you "chose your body type

The ratios change based on whether you are:
1)Hard time gaining weight
2)Need to gain LBM, but do not have excess BF%
3)Have too much BF, but want to gain/maintian LBM
4)Have an easy time gaining body fat.

As an illustration I present the following (all male - no chauvanism intended):

250lbs M (ANY AGE) 200lbs M
Cal Ratio Cal Ratio
P: 1000 .195 800 .199
F: 1534 .299 1227 .305
C: 2580 .504 2064 .514
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tot: 5114 .998 4091 1.018

OR: P 20% F 30% C 50%

The caloric requirements change with weight, but THE RATIOS OF PROTEIN/CARB/FAT to TOTAL CALORIES DOES NOT CHANGE!

The ratios are as follows based on how you answered your body type
1) Hard time add weight P 20%/F 30%/ C 50%
2)Need gain LBM P 22%/F 30%/ C 48%
3)Have LBM but excess BF P 25%/ F 30%/ C 45%
4) Put on BF easily P 30%/F 30%/ C 40%

This means if we could develop "base" recipies based on the above ratios - you could just then choose how many servings to eat. Yes I know some of them might be difficult..

EXAMPLE: You are body type #1 Hard gainer
Johnnys Slappy Cakes
1 serv=
4 grams Protein/6 grams Fat/ 10 grams carbs
20% 30% 50%

Mike's Chicken Somethingorother
1 serving =
40 grams Protein/ 60 grams Fat/ 100 grams carb
20% 30% 50%

Then to get to your daily goal, just figure out ROUGHLY how many servings you would need a day of the various "BASE RECIPIES" to meet your caloric needs (the only other variable in the meal calculator). The recipies take care of the correct ratio of protein/fat/carbs - you just make sure to eat at the correct intervals and eat the correct number of servings (not too many/not too little) so you eat often enough and dont exceed caloric limits.

Each body type (4 of them) would have it's own recipies - because each body type would have different macronutrient needs. And then for each body type there would be a variety of "BASE RECIPIES" in the correct macronutrient ratio. Am I making sense here?

The beauty of it is - it does not really matter how much the calories are or how many grams of this and that there are AS LONG AS THE RATIOS of the BASE RECIPIES are correct. The rest is multiplication - whether you eat 1 or 10 of the Mike's Somethingorother, you will get them in the proper ratio - just make sure you eat the right # of servings and don't go over your daily caloric limit. How many servings of what and how often to eat them would be up to you. But if you have 10-12 choices of different selections, you could easily mix and match yourself.

This same "engine" could ask if you take Flax Oil or another oil - how many times and what the nutritional info would be - same goes for protein. These could then be factored in, and would change the ratios of food needed.

This would by no means give 100% solution. But if it could get you close and then allow you to search for a food by 1) Grams of fat first, and then carbs second. Or 2)let you find a snack that has 9 grams of fat and 1 gram of carb, etc....or 3) Find 100 calorie foods , etc....you could fill in the gaps that occur because you couldn't eat 1.0567 of Johhny's Slappy Cakes and rounded down to 1.

I know some of the ratios may be slightly hard to achieve - but I think this could be a very doable way to come up with "units" that would allow variety for structured meal plans such as this. You would only have to come up with 5-6 different UNITS/ BASE RECIPIES per body type (and maybe another 5-6 recipies per body type for women, I don't know, I didn't run those numbers) - but if we could come up with those 20 some odd recipies (they may overlap - so it may well be far less than that) - I think it would be great.

Any feedback - am I just crazy, or is this an idea that could work?

Hopefully this made sense...
-H

ps - I am going to try and practice what I preach and find some recipies that meet these ratios....Maybe that will either prove it cannot be done, or that maybe it is a decent idea....either way...thanks for reading this ridiculously long post.....

WillBrink
09-03-2003, 11:29 PM
Originally posted by mdwchang
Yeah, I think this is where it's important to examine what people really need. My suggestion is really for best matches, not exact matches. In reality, we don't look for exact matches when, for instance, we buy MRP's. We look for something close, and then make the needed adjustments.

And I agree, 1.534 servings sounds ridiculous. Just have the program only evaluate whole numbers of servings (or down to half servings).

The main thing is, I want to find a meal... ANY meal, that matches at least somewhat with my split. I can fudge or adjust the rest. I guess my point is that trying to find good recipes that match a particular meal profile is easier than trying to find a set of good recipes that matches an entire meal plan. It also would be reassuring for a beginner to try a meal that another experienced person uses as part of their regimen.

We already have a section where people have been listing their recipes. People can use some of them and adjust to their own calorie/macro nutrient breakdowns. As Simon points out, a few example diets are of no use at all really as the person still has to do exactly the same thing as before. The best way to start, as with anything, is keep it simple. Using basic info like 6 ounces of chicken, one meduim sized sweet potatoe, etc, is easy to track and figure out calories, and so on. And of course other foods will have their entire figures on the label if they come in any sort of container. As the person gets used dealing with such things, they move onto more complex recipes. At the moment, it's the only way to do it. There is diet software out there where you plug in your numbers and it tracks all sorts of info for you. I recall one was called Diet Balancer that seemed to do a good job, but some imput of info will always be the norm until our comps have ESP:D

Hispie
09-03-2003, 11:50 PM
I think anywhere is a great place to start. And I agree, putting it together "modularly", instead of all at the same time.

That would allow better utilization, and probably cheaper too.

-H

Hispie
09-03-2003, 11:53 PM
Thanks guys!

Simon
09-04-2003, 09:09 AM
The main thing is, I want to find a meal... ANY meal, that matches at least somewhat with my split. I can fudge or adjust the rest. I guess my point is that trying to find good recipes that match a particular meal profile is easier than trying to find a set of good recipes that matches an entire meal plan. It also would be reassuring for a beginner to try a meal that another experienced person uses as part of their regimen. [/B][/QUOTE]

I agree totally, listen you really don't need to convince me, I think it would be a great tool and I am more than willing to invest in it as I think it would be very helpful for our members , I will investigate further this week

Dasse
09-05-2003, 09:31 AM
Simes!
Tried to view Charles S. answer to your question but found out that it wasnīt your question but the same as the previous concerning low levels of testosterone! Could you fix this please.

Simon
09-06-2003, 09:55 AM
Thanks Dasse

I must have overwritten it. Have fixed and added another article by Charles

Thanks for heads up

SIMES

dgill888
09-29-2003, 05:59 PM
Hey SIMES,

Count me in as a HUGE supporter of adding DPS to the list of supplement places. I've been ordering from there for 5 years now. They're amazing at getting things to you (average of two days), and their customer service is hands down the greatest I've ever seen. They always have good deals there, the lowest prices on everything, and if there's ever a problem, they're great at dealing with it. In the five years I've been with them, they messed up an order only once, and they solved the prob by letting me keep the extra item they'd sent, and sent me the item they'd forgotten via express mail so I got it the very next day. They're great!
-Dan

VicCina
10-10-2003, 05:28 AM
Does anyone have any suggestions on a good piece of software that will calculate your body composition and come up with daily menus for different stages of weight training? ie.. cutting, mass building etc....


Vic

Simon
10-10-2003, 01:50 PM
Originally posted by VicCina
Does anyone have any suggestions on a good piece of software that will calculate your body composition and come up with daily menus for different stages of weight training? ie.. cutting, mass building etc....


Vic

We have software int he members zone that wil calcualte your body fat, however the meal plans so far seems to be beyond any programmer due to the inherent difficulaites with such software.

We are currently writing some s/w which will allow you create your own meals . I will have some demos available soon

MikeSki
10-10-2003, 07:47 PM
The Daily Meal Planner was supposed to be up and running on Aug 15, '03. What gives?

Simon
10-11-2003, 07:33 AM
Originally posted by MikeSki
The Daily Meal Planner was supposed to be up and running on Aug 15, '03. What gives?

What gives is that lifes a bitch, and programming to make this thing really usefull as been a pain.

Just hold your damm horses. Man, try to do people a favour for free and I get grief!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hopefully should be finished to the point where I will allow around 10 people to play with it in about 3 days time.

SIMES

alanjlamore
10-12-2003, 07:04 AM
"Each body type (4 of them) would have it's own recipies - because each body type would have different macronutrient needs. And then for each body type there would be a variety of "BASE RECIPIES" in the correct macronutrient ratio. Am I making sense here?

The beauty of it is - it does not really matter how much the calories are or how many grams of this and that there are AS LONG AS THE RATIOS of the BASE RECIPIES are correct. The rest is multiplication - whether you eat 1 or 10 of the Mike's Somethingorother, you will get them in the proper ratio - just make sure you eat the right # of servings and don't go over your daily caloric limit. How many servings of what and how often to eat them would be up to you. But if you have 10-12 choices of different selections, you could easily mix and match yourself.

This same "engine" could ask if you take Flax Oil or another oil - how many times and what the nutritional info would be - same goes for protein. These could then be factored in, and would change the ratios of food needed.

This would by no means give 100% solution. But if it could get you close and then allow you to search for a food by 1) Grams of fat first, and then carbs second. Or 2)let you find a snack that has 9 grams of fat and 1 gram of carb, etc....or 3) Find 100 calorie foods , etc....you could fill in the gaps that occur because you couldn't eat 1.0567 of Johhny's Slappy Cakes and rounded down to 1.

I know some of the ratios may be slightly hard to achieve - but I think this could be a very doable way to come up with "units" that would allow variety for structured meal plans such as this. You would only have to come up with 5-6 different UNITS/ BASE RECIPIES per body type (and maybe another 5-6 recipies per body type for women, I don't know, I didn't run those numbers) - but if we could come up with those 20 some odd recipies (they may overlap - so it may well be far less than that) - I think it would be great.

Any feedback - am I just crazy, or is this an idea that could work?

Hopefully this made sense...
-H"

I think hispie has a great idea here.
This whole idea of getting something to spit out meals that are close to the ratios of pro, fat and carbs is an AWESOME idea.
I would definitely pay for a download of a program like that and I think a lot of other people would too.
I can definitely see how this can be marketable!!

Simon
10-12-2003, 08:13 AM
Originally posted by alanjlamore
"Each body type (4 of them) would have it's own recipies - because each body type would have different macronutrient needs. And then for each body type there would be a variety of "BASE RECIPIES" in the correct macronutrient ratio. Am I making sense here?

The beauty of it is - it does not really matter how much the calories are or how many grams of this and that there are AS LONG AS THE RATIOS of the BASE RECIPIES are correct. The rest is multiplication - whether you eat 1 or 10 of the Mike's Somethingorother, you will get them in the proper ratio - just make sure you eat the right # of servings and don't go over your daily caloric limit. How many servings of what and how often to eat them would be up to you. But if you have 10-12 choices of different selections, you could easily mix and match yourself.

This same "engine" could ask if you take Flax Oil or another oil - how many times and what the nutritional info would be - same goes for protein. These could then be factored in, and would change the ratios of food needed.

This would by no means give 100% solution. But if it could get you close and then allow you to search for a food by 1) Grams of fat first, and then carbs second. Or 2)let you find a snack that has 9 grams of fat and 1 gram of carb, etc....or 3) Find 100 calorie foods , etc....you could fill in the gaps that occur because you couldn't eat 1.0567 of Johhny's Slappy Cakes and rounded down to 1.

I know some of the ratios may be slightly hard to achieve - but I think this could be a very doable way to come up with "units" that would allow variety for structured meal plans such as this. You would only have to come up with 5-6 different UNITS/ BASE RECIPIES per body type (and maybe another 5-6 recipies per body type for women, I don't know, I didn't run those numbers) - but if we could come up with those 20 some odd recipies (they may overlap - so it may well be far less than that) - I think it would be great.

Any feedback - am I just crazy, or is this an idea that could work?

Hopefully this made sense...
-H"

I think hispie has a great idea here.
This whole idea of getting something to spit out meals that are close to the ratios of pro, fat and carbs is an AWESOME idea.
I would definitely pay for a download of a program like that and I think a lot of other people would too.
I can definitely see how this can be marketable!!


I can tell you now that no such software exists, and that in itself is an indicator, when you consider the potential market from the weight loss industry alone, as to how hard this software would be.

Trust me if it could be done, it would be.

We are working on something that is not as automatic as creating the meals for you, but it's pretty usefull

Demo availabel soon
And it will be free to all MBN members

MikeSki
10-13-2003, 07:10 PM
Sorry - My intention was not to raise your blood pressure.
I'm new to the site and still learning how to navigate, etc.
I can relate to your frustrations as I have been trying to develop a daily planner using excel. It works pretty well but its a bitch to constantly cut/paste, etc.
I look forward to the final product. We can compare notes, eh?
Later

Simon
10-13-2003, 09:14 PM
Originally posted by MikeSki
Sorry - My intention was not to raise your blood pressure.
I'm new to the site and still learning how to navigate, etc.
I can relate to your frustrations as I have been trying to develop a daily planner using excel. It works pretty well but its a bitch to constantly cut/paste, etc.
I look forward to the final product. We can compare notes, eh?
Later


No problem.

ps I have tried having some excel stuff done for us to give away , but it has always fallen short and of course not everybody has excel.

The stuff I am finishing now is all run online.

Should have demo in 2 days time now

I iwll announce it on here to get some testers

SIMES

Ryan
10-15-2003, 11:53 PM
Hey, I am really psyched about the new supplements section and all, but I wanted to do some reviewing of what you guys had in the supps section before and I can't. Is ther any way to fix that or do I just gotta wait until you guys have the new one running?

Thanks, you guys are the bomb,
Ryan VanOrsdel

Simon
10-16-2003, 08:25 AM
Originally posted by Ryan
Hey, I am really psyched about the new supplements section and all, but I wanted to do some reviewing of what you guys had in the supps section before and I can't. Is ther any way to fix that or do I just gotta wait until you guys have the new one running?

Thanks, you guys are the bomb,
Ryan VanOrsdel

What new supps section? What are you referring to?

Ryan
10-16-2003, 05:54 PM
When I go on the members area, and click on the supps section it says there is going to be a new supps section.
Ryan

Simon
10-18-2003, 10:52 AM
Hello All

I hope to have the Meal Planner software finished to a point where I can let a handful of people have a play with it and be human guinea pigs.

As the people on this thread seemed the most interested I will offer it out here first.

I need about 5 people to have a play with it, make your diets, save them, add recipes, etc, etc using it.

I should have a workable application finished by next Tuesday the 21st.

Hand's up who want's in to trial it.

Remember this can not magically create your meals for you, you need to add them and save them.

SIMES

Simon
10-18-2003, 10:52 AM
Originally posted by Ryan
When I go on the members area, and click on the supps section it says there is going to be a new supps section.
Ryan

Oops, sorry Ryan, I forgot about that section. As of now we have not really had any ideas on how that would work. Do you have any ideas of what would be interesting there?

jwsplatjw
10-18-2003, 02:12 PM
I'm in.

alanjlamore
10-18-2003, 02:18 PM
You can count me in.
I have all the time in the world to play around with it (I plan on being the "stay-at-home" dad).

My wife should be in labor very soon though, so I might have to miss a day (we're going to the hospital again in a couple of hours).

I'll be able to use it for hours a day if needed.

Ryan
10-22-2003, 07:33 PM
1.) I think the best thing that could be on the supps section would be a line of supps that Will himself has deigned. Iknow this idea has been bouncing around, I just wanna say again that I am alll for it.

2.) I could also use a list of the supps that are popular on this site(super 1+, hydroxycut, 6-oxo) with a simple pro and con list with each. I find myself wondering "hmmm will super one + make me lose my hair like 1-ad does?" but I don't want to make a post every time I have a question about a pro or con.

There are my ideas for that supp section.
Thanks,
Ryan VanOrsdel

Simon
10-23-2003, 08:54 AM
Originally posted by Ryan
1.) I think the best thing that could be on the supps section would be a line of supps that Will himself has deigned. Iknow this idea has been bouncing around, I just wanna say again that I am alll for it.

2.) I could also use a list of the supps that are popular on this site(super 1+, hydroxycut, 6-oxo) with a simple pro and con list with each. I find myself wondering "hmmm will super one + make me lose my hair like 1-ad does?" but I don't want to make a post every time I have a question about a pro or con.

There are my ideas for that supp section.
Thanks,
Ryan VanOrsdel

Yes the latter suggestion is an idea for sure. There is only one problem, we have to tread a fine line with branded supps, if we go around saying xxx is better than xxx, then we get screams of biased, and this is worthless, your all paid money by xxxx to promote their supps.

Trust me there are some dumb ass internet weirdos out there, they go loopy on you .

That was the reason I created the 'rating's section on the brand name part of the forum so all the members coudl rate supps for others and it would be 100% independant and also provide the best kind of recommendation, real world feedback.

Re, Will's own supps line, we are consdidering all that currently.

KJL
10-23-2003, 05:14 PM
SIMES

Count me in for testing/trying the new Meal Planner.

Thanks and looking forward to it!

aussie
10-28-2003, 08:45 AM
g'day, i was just wondering about the meal planer is it up and running or what ? not that i have seen it but it sounds like a fantastic idea, well done. thank you brett

plague
12-19-2003, 09:02 PM
Has anyone created a software program that will plan meals for you, based on goals, weight, age...etc....etc.....?

I am finding it hard to find the time to plan effectively and I think it is now affecting my gains. I have found lost of software that shows or tracks types of food, calories, nutrients, etc that you input.....such as fitday.com. But an actual meal planner with all of these foods in it, that can spit out a daily meal plan, with the correct amount of calories you require.etc

Its a thought and maybe could be online like fitday and numerous other sites.

Recap: Instead of a meal input software is there a meal output software?

erp7e
12-19-2003, 09:51 PM
I'm not aware of anything like this existing but man it would be a gold mine of a marketing idea. Will, Simes, anyone?

plague
12-19-2003, 10:28 PM
I'm not aware of anything like this existing but man it would be a gold mine of a marketing idea. Will, Simes, anyone?
==============================================

LOL...maybe I should have just done it....
I think it's a great idea and people would flock to it for the simple reason, we lack time in our days (I seem to right now anyways)as it is and to think, plan, for multiple meals takes time. I have started to focus on bodybuilding instead of powerlifting as I was doing, and though weightlifting in general are a lifestyle, bodybuilding is moreso.

Simon
12-30-2003, 04:42 PM
Originally posted by plague
Has anyone created a software program that will plan meals for you, based on goals, weight, age...etc....etc.....?

I am finding it hard to find the time to plan effectively and I think it is now affecting my gains. I have found lost of software that shows or tracks types of food, calories, nutrients, etc that you input.....such as fitday.com. But an actual meal planner with all of these foods in it, that can spit out a daily meal plan, with the correct amount of calories you require.etc

Its a thought and maybe could be online like fitday and numerous other sites.

Recap: Instead of a meal input software is there a meal output software?

We have been trying to get a programmer to do this for months, but they have all thrown in the towel claming extreme comlications.

I won' go into it, but suffice to say , it's bloody akward..
Yes it would be very popular, but the very fact that nothing like this exists, when it's so obviously a massivfe seller tells you how awkward it is

eimagery
12-30-2003, 05:43 PM
There are a few places that do this, ediets.com is one.

They have plans for Atkins, Zone and even the "Dr. Phil" plan, whatever that is. Maybe it's a "Do as I say, not as I do" plan

They do not have a plan that most on this board would use for long range goals.

I could see how this would be a nightmare to program. All different bodyweights, body types, goals, and meal preferences.

Simes,

It might be worth your while to partnership with someone like ediets who already has the database setup. With the subscriber rates of Will's ebooks, and some of the other strength training gurus to endorse it, I would think it would do as well for ediets as any of the other diets they have.

Matt

Rodan
01-02-2004, 04:18 PM
I was trying to find one of these programs a few months ago... unfortunatley the only ones I came across were far from what I would call 'adequate'. The problem was that they were not tailored for my needs.

So one day I sat down and planned out a MS access database to track meals, workout, ect. and give a summary of everything I think is important. Initially it was a far bit of work, and it still is a 'work in progress', but now all I do is select meals based on if I am gaining or cutting, and it totals and store all the info I need.

Unfortunately, I don't have the time or patients to input a huge variety of ingredients into the database, so i input it 'as required'. My diet doesn't change very much from day-to-day, so at first I just inputed my most used ingredients, and most popular meals. If I want to try a new recipe it takes about 1-2 min to add it. Once the recipe is added, it takes less than a minute to plan my meals for the day.

alanjlamore
01-02-2004, 05:40 PM
I think this was discussed in another thread and it seemed like everyone wanted it, but it would be extremely difficult and time consuming.

I think most software is very time consuming and that's why I chose not to get my degree in computer science.

I feel confident that it is possible, but it just might be too time consuming and/or expensive to be practicle.

I wonder how much a team of programmers would charge for something like this (if they'd agree to attempt it).

It might be worth having it done, but one would probably need a lot of money to get it started.

Simon
01-02-2004, 07:59 PM
Originally posted by Rodan
I was trying to find one of these programs a few months ago... unfortunatley the only ones I came across were far from what I would call 'adequate'. The problem was that they were not tailored for my needs.

So one day I sat down and planned out a MS access database to track meals, workout, ect. and give a summary of everything I think is important. Initially it was a far bit of work, and it still is a 'work in progress', but now all I do is select meals based on if I am gaining or cutting, and it totals and store all the info I need.

Unfortunately, I don't have the time or patients to input a huge variety of ingredients into the database, so i input it 'as required'. My diet doesn't change very much from day-to-day, so at first I just inputed my most used ingredients, and most popular meals. If I want to try a new recipe it takes about 1-2 min to add it. Once the recipe is added, it takes less than a minute to plan my meals for the day.

Rodan

Can I see a demo of this..

does it spit out a days meals after you enter a total calorie and macronutrient split? Because that is what people are after

Pandemonium
01-02-2004, 10:02 PM
hey ppl...
prorgamming is overrated... way overrated...
it is a very simple process if u have the right ideas...

stage 1 : collect all ideas
this is the longest stage, its like the only thing that needs 'creativity' which in turn needs inspiration and a clear mind.

stage 2 : translation
basically, and simply, just translate your thoughts to another language... a computer language. i know a few myself and its not even my field.

stage 3 : Prog Beta 1
this version is a very large, inefficient program. it contains all ideas, and to the user the only imp notice is low speed and many bugs.

stage 4 : Pre-Release
this version is the same as stage 3, except with a much smaller application size, much more efficient means of doing things.

stage 5 : Release
This is the seemingly bug-free, optimised, closed source, legally protected version of the program.

I am personally becoming very good at VB.net and i believe this whole project isn't too hard to accomplish. I am willing to work on it for free, and release it as freeware. This should take no longer than 1 or 2 months time to finalize all 5 steps, given one is not too pre-occupied. it could take as little as a week, but the longer the better.

I can pretty much figure out how to integrate most stuff into the program.. but the food database intrugues me... how to implement it, while keeping the program small in size for easy distribution. One solution would be an online database that the program automatically connects to to get nutritional info for all foods, and just obtain the values for the user selected foods. but this would mean maintenance costs :s

I believe if Will and SIMES and whoever else is moderating this forum would agree to this idea, we could create a forum room where ppl post what they want in this program once i begin working on it, so i can implement features as it goes, using technical info from the more experienced users of this forum.

i am optimistic about such projects. especially when backed by a fine range of experienced minds in the field of the program's main aim.

i personally will be free from early february for a month or two, where most major portions of the program could be finished, tested, and optimized. Then i will continue work on it, adding anything new, and fixing any bugs etc.

the same program could accept small config files for different sorts of training methods for easy update. within the prog itself could be exercise techniques, maybe even animations, etc.

so... what do you think?
================

Simon
01-03-2004, 12:27 PM
Originally posted by Pandemonium
hey ppl...
prorgamming is overrated... way overrated...
it is a very simple process if u have the right ideas...

stage 1 : collect all ideas
this is the longest stage, its like the only thing that needs 'creativity' which in turn needs inspiration and a clear mind.

stage 2 : translation
basically, and simply, just translate your thoughts to another language... a computer language. i know a few myself and its not even my field.

stage 3 : Prog Beta 1
this version is a very large, inefficient program. it contains all ideas, and to the user the only imp notice is low speed and many bugs.

stage 4 : Pre-Release
this version is the same as stage 3, except with a much smaller application size, much more efficient means of doing things.

stage 5 : Release
This is the seemingly bug-free, optimised, closed source, legally protected version of the program.

I am personally becoming very good at VB.net and i believe this whole project isn't too hard to accomplish. I am willing to work on it for free, and release it as freeware. This should take no longer than 1 or 2 months time to finalize all 5 steps, given one is not too pre-occupied. it could take as little as a week, but the longer the better.

I can pretty much figure out how to integrate most stuff into the program.. but the food database intrugues me... how to implement it, while keeping the program small in size for easy distribution. One solution would be an online database that the program automatically connects to to get nutritional info for all foods, and just obtain the values for the user selected foods. but this would mean maintenance costs :s

I believe if Will and SIMES and whoever else is moderating this forum would agree to this idea, we could create a forum room where ppl post what they want in this program once i begin working on it, so i can implement features as it goes, using technical info from the more experienced users of this forum.

i am optimistic about such projects. especially when backed by a fine range of experienced minds in the field of the program's main aim.

i personally will be free from early february for a month or two, where most major portions of the program could be finished, tested, and optimized. Then i will continue work on it, adding anything new, and fixing any bugs etc.

the same program could accept small config files for different sorts of training methods for easy update. within the prog itself could be exercise techniques, maybe even animations, etc.

so... what do you think?
================

I have run this by many highly advanced programmers who all jumped around telling me how easy it was only to come back after weeks of failues to tell me they simply couldn't make it work effectively

If however you think it can be done, I would be happy to pay you for your time to do it properly.

I believe it should be run online, predominantly because it can then be used from any PC with a login and a browser, because it can easily be updated and patched, because we can link to the USDA food database, etc, etc.

This has been discussed many many times before, but the basic premise is this

User enters a total daily calories required
User enters required macronutrient split
User enters days training on and times (so post workout meal differ from standard meal macronutrients etc

The system then spits out all the meals for a training and non training day matching the calories and macronutrient split required for the day.

That's the basics.....

I am going to merge all the existing threads on meal planner s.w into this one thread.

SIMES

Pandemonium
01-03-2004, 05:43 PM
okay.. where to start...
i can figure why programmers tend to stop working on the project.. it is actually quite simple, it would seem not worth it, too complicated, etc. for someone who will not be making use of it themselves.
i am not guaranteeing an excellent program, nor am i expecting payment for my work, unless you like it enough to make it commercial by adding it to your book etc.

in any case, about the online thing...
it would be a better, more global idea indeed, however i am not sure if i can program a complete server-side solution at the moment. I did webdesign a while back, but server applications were limited to a file getting a certain value from a database. However, i believe it will not take much work to learn this, as i have already learned how to make client-server applications, i will check to make sure if there isn't much to learn.

in any case, this won't be costing anyone anything... so if it fails, it will just be a vacation time loss... i personally consider programming a hobby, plus its not like i'll be doing it 10 hours a day, so i don't mind a failure. If you want to buy it as commercial, then you can wait until the final version is ready and if it is perfect enough, you may as well commercialize it.

pan

Rodan
01-03-2004, 07:35 PM
Originally posted by SIMES
Rodan

Can I see a demo of this..

does it spit out a days meals after you enter a total calorie and macronutrient split? Because that is what people are after

Unfortunately, it doesn't do this. It is more of a personal tracking system than anything else, with built-in calculations. It isn't quite what you are looking for. The meals have to be entered manually (based on the macronutrient ratios you want) but once they are entered you simply select and all the daily totals and percentages are totalled automatically.

I can certainly see how you are having programmers underestimate the complexity of something like this. There are alot of issues, that you are probably aware of, that really complicates things if you want to make it useful for people.

Years ago (before I knew anything) I signed up for a website that spit out a meal plan. Although, it did work (ie. it did spit out the meals), the plan was very specific with what you eat. If you wanted to make substitutions it was a pain. It also didn't take personal taste, alergies, or needs into account. It also only gave you totals of calories. I believed it used a universal one-size-fits-all approach with regards to macro nutrient ratios. It was also quite expensive. I ended up requesting a refund after about 3 days.

I certainly think that what you are looking for can be done... that is, if you find a programmer who realizes in-the-beginning all the complexities that are involded.

Simon
01-04-2004, 01:04 PM
Originally posted by Rodan
Unfortunately, it doesn't do this. It is more of a personal tracking system than anything else, with built-in calculations. It isn't quite what you are looking for. The meals have to be entered manually (based on the macronutrient ratios you want) but once they are entered you simply select and all the daily totals and percentages are totalled automatically.

I can certainly see how you are having programmers underestimate the complexity of something like this. There are alot of issues, that you are probably aware of, that really complicates things if you want to make it useful for people.

Years ago (before I knew anything) I signed up for a website that spit out a meal plan. Although, it did work (ie. it did spit out the meals), the plan was very specific with what you eat. If you wanted to make substitutions it was a pain. It also didn't take personal taste, alergies, or needs into account. It also only gave you totals of calories. I believed it used a universal one-size-fits-all approach with regards to macro nutrient ratios. It was also quite expensive. I ended up requesting a refund after about 3 days.

I certainly think that what you are looking for can be done... that is, if you find a programmer who realizes in-the-beginning all the complexities that are involded.

Rodan

Yes, we actually are days away from releasing our own version of what you have done to our members, that side of it is relatively easy, we have had an online one done, it's a pretty good tool, I will be letting a few members trial it soon.

Althought pandemonium seems to think programers thought it was to easy, that is so far from reality it's not true.

I spent weeks with different programmers, they tried all kinds of ways around it , and all admitted defeat... the variations and compexitiies were staggering, they told me it would take months and months to do somethign of this nature .

If you check out this thread, we have discussed some of the reasons as to why it was such a pain , I don't want to reiterate them but they are damm akward..

If pandemonium manages it , it will be great news .

WillBrink
01-04-2004, 03:16 PM
Originally posted by SIMES
Rodan

Yes, we actually are days away from releasing our own version of what you have done to our members, that side of it is relatively easy, we have had an online one done, it's a pretty good tool, I will be letting a few members trial it soon.

Althought pandemonium seems to think programers thought it was to easy, that is so far from reality it's not true.

I spent weeks with different programmers, they tried all kinds of ways around it , and all admitted defeat... the variations and compexitiies were staggering, they told me it would take months and months to do somethign of this nature .

If you check out this thread, we have discussed some of the reasons as to why it was such a pain , I don't want to reiterate them but they are damm akward..

If pandemonium manages it , it will be great news .

I would think one of the major issues is that most programmers don't workout and or deal with nutritional issues, so they think "how hard could it be?" and say yes to the project. Having done a few thousand diets in my life and knowing the HUGE number of possible variables, I knew (without any programming experience) that it would be a near impossible task. If you recall Si, I had mentioned that before you spoke to any programmers. :(

Pandemonium
01-04-2004, 05:11 PM
hello...
you say they said it would take months... let it take months, does it really matter if you end up with a quality product? even if you don't, my motto has always been, if it doesn't cost anything, try it... hmm (don't quote me for that! lol)
--
maybe u weren't available to those programmers every other day or so too provide feedback on certain issues... maybe they couldn't manage to fit the pieces together simply for the ignorance of the aim of the program. Maybe they thought it wouldn't be worthwhile commercially, since they could work 2 or more much simpler projects that they come across every day for the same price... so why get into something totally knew, waste double the time for the same price.
--
I will try this regardless, i don't mind failure. it's a good idea that could help alot of ppl.

I understand ur reluctance to .. well, put hopes on this project.. so don't. Just let it be, or not. There will always be meaningless thread on any forum, just consider that one of them.

As for variation... i very much commend the laziness of ur programmers if u didn't give them a size restriction. If one cannot make 2 systems work using the same program, he may as well make each on a seperate program then just collect them together.

As for diet-related meal planning...
it may very well be hard to mix all foods in "coherent" meals... however, simply giving the user an option to move a certain food around between meals wouldn't be too hard to implement.
--


i am looking forward to this.
pan

plague
01-10-2004, 09:54 PM
I have just finished a database/web app for my business. The idea, design, functionality was of my own doing, the programming was by someone else. The key to success in any project is to have someone who knows both sides of the coin, such as nutriotion/bodybuilding and they must know computers. Having access to a good programmer is only part of it. The ability for a programmer to understand and realize the same goal you do is more of a key than knowledge of the actual code itself. I went through 4 programmers before I found one who was a good listener, and who could interpret what I was saying accurately and he did an excellent job. Most of the ones I had found went off into their own little world of how THEY thought it should be done. They would almost block out what I was saying. Then days later they would come to me saying that they wanted to do things this way and that and I would then blow a gasket and say this is what I said during a meeting, and had they just stopped to LISTEN then we would not have wasted all of this time.

I don't think it is necessary to try to cater to all 3 billion?? people on the planet. Have the program spit out a meal based on user macro requirements, giving them a baseline to work from. The user can then modify it to suit.

The key here is anything is possible these days, even this. The question is, who will do this first.

alanjlamore
01-10-2004, 11:58 PM
Good points plaugue.

Maybee it could also be set up to constantly accept new foods into it's database, then it just has to spit out the amt of that food that could go with whatever other foods, to make the desired nutritional requirements.

If you were to load it up with a whole bunch of healthy foods and make the program figure out the quantities and give the results in the form of a big list of different combinations.

That way, the person can just pick through the list and find what he/she likes, kind of like a search engine.

You could also add in some borderline/bad foods and group them into a different category, and have the program ask the user if they're willing to incorporated that type of food as well (like bread, pasta, over processed stuff...).

That way other people who want to limit their macronutrient intake, but don't want to give up their processed stuff can also use this.

I guess there could be all kinds of filters on this so it would eliminate a lot of search time.

Pandemonium
01-11-2004, 03:17 AM
Originally posted by plague
I have just finished a database/web app for my business. The idea, design, functionality was of my own doing, the programming was by someone else. The key to success in any project is to have someone who knows both sides of the coin, such as nutriotion/bodybuilding and they must know computers. Having access to a good programmer is only part of it. The ability for a programmer to understand and realize the same goal you do is more of a key than knowledge of the actual code itself. I went through 4 programmers before I found one who was a good listener, and who could interpret what I was saying accurately and he did an excellent job. Most of the ones I had found went off into their own little world of how THEY thought it should be done. They would almost block out what I was saying. Then days later they would come to me saying that they wanted to do things this way and that and I would then blow a gasket and say this is what I said during a meeting, and had they just stopped to LISTEN then we would not have wasted all of this time.

I don't think it is necessary to try to cater to all 3 billion?? people on the planet. Have the program spit out a meal based on user macro requirements, giving them a baseline to work from. The user can then modify it to suit.

The key here is anything is possible these days, even this. The question is, who will do this first.

indeed, the point i was trying to make. i am not saying this would be a very simple task, but given the correct ideas and info, any programmer could do it.

erp7e
01-11-2004, 08:58 PM
If said programmer were really smart, he or she'd make it so that the program could spit out diets for various diet plans, i.e., metabolic-type diet, ketogenic, higher-carb, etc., as well as different calorie levels, plus be able to adjust it to "get more animal protein" or "get more essential fatty acids" and the program would be able to modify the diet that way. Also take into account people's metabolic rates, activity levels, workout program volumes and types, sports played, etc. A program that spit out a cookie cutter diet wouldn't be as useful.

Simon
01-20-2004, 05:30 PM
Ok folks, the new meal planning s/w is ready to trial, I've fashioned it based on how i what I wanted, now I want around 5 people to have a play with it and give me some feedback, ideas and suggestions.

Please drop me an email at [email protected] if you would like to trial it and offer me feedback , suggestions etc.

It's essentially designed to keep a full track of your diet, add recipes, meal plans, etc...

Once, we have had a few members trialling it, then we can let everyone have it.

SIMES

Pandemonium
01-25-2004, 01:28 AM
:confused:

Simon
01-29-2004, 02:56 PM
Originally posted by Pandemonium
:confused:

Ahh, I think your confusing our meal planner s/w which is basically a way of planning and keeping a record of your diet with what is being discussed here which is s/w which can spit out an entire diet for you.

This we have not done..
Check out this thread for more info:
http://bodybuildingrevealed.com/members/board/showthread.php?threadid=1363

Pandemonium
01-30-2004, 07:45 PM
i see.. lol
in any case, i am afraid i will be in a negative position here, but..
i may not stick to what i have promised. we had some trouble and delays with exams, and umm.. i have a few makeups to do.
i will see what happens, i am leaving on vacation till next week, when i'm back i will see how i can organise my time.

sorry for the inconsistancy, but i guess this is why i didn't take this officially as a job, i know things like this will happen.

peace,
see u all in a week. :)

plague
02-08-2004, 06:09 PM
Ok folks, the new meal planning s/w is ready to trial, I've fashioned it based on how i what I wanted, now I want around 5 people to have a play with it and give me some feedback, ideas and suggestions.

======================

Did you get your 5 people?

NikHUM
02-09-2004, 12:02 AM
Count me in!

signpainter51
06-05-2004, 04:35 AM
When I add an item, it asks for # for protein. I am trying to add catfish fillets. The package says 4 oz. = to 90 calories, fat 3.5 grams, saturated fat 1gram. Carbs 0. Now it says protein 16 grams. What number do I add to proteins? Serving size is 4 oz. but on the list at the bottm it says 16g for protein.

Simon
06-05-2004, 02:15 PM
Heh???

If you have a new item you just add whatever the numbers are:

So in the description you put

catfish 4 oz

Then if that 4oz has 16 gram of protein in it, that's what you enter
If it has 4.5

Carbs 0

That's it , not sure what you mean really, you add to the protein box whatever protein is in the food your adding.