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View Full Version : Erp, your medical opinion requested



WillBrink
04-06-2005, 12:41 AM
Erp, I got an email from a Sgt of the SWAT team in DC. He said:

“My team has had several applicants fail PT during the initial school due to Rhabdomyalosis (unsure of spelling). we were told it was due to over use of creatine, protien and other supplements and intense training which contributed to renal failure. I would appreciate any information on this topic if you have it. We spoke with Patricia Duester USN Bethesda Naval Hospital Training consultant for SEAL fitness”

Is it me, or is she crazy? There is no data at all showing creatine and or protein supplements cause this condition. Rhabdomyolysis is the breakdown of muscle fibers with leakage of potentially
toxic cellular contents into the systemic circulation, which is where the kidney issues come in. There is a decent write up here:

http://www.emedicine.com/emerg/topic508.htm


Note creatine and protein are not listed as causes. If anything,
those to supps might help reduce or prevent it, assuming adequate hydration, etc. Is this the best they can do for info?


Without knowing much more about these guys, it’s hard to comment in depth, but it's most likely it was caused by the type and duration/intensity of the exercise they did, dehydration, and other possible variables. Am I missing something here from a medical perspective? What would you suspect here?

erp7e
04-06-2005, 06:01 PM
I'm with you on this one.

Rhabdomyolysis can occur as a result of very intense training. Especially, in this case, if the training involved a lot of combat training, weapons training, etc., i.e. a lot of mechanical stress. If you really beat the crap out of someone, they could get rhabdo. Perfectly healthy people who get in really bad car accidents can develop rhabdo and kidney failure.

Additionally, if the training was a sudden increase in mechanical stress from what they were used to. Such as if an unfit person attempted to run a marathon cold without proper training, etc.

There is no evidence that it is caused by creatine or protein intake, nor is there any reasonable physiologic rationale for such a theory. There is no data to support the offhand, uninformed, biased remarks being passed off as fact by this fitness consultant. And to think our tax dollars pay her salary...

WillBrink
04-06-2005, 06:07 PM
Rhabdomyolysis can occur as a result of very intense training. Especially, in this case, if the training involved a lot of combat training, weapons training, etc., i.e. a lot of mechanical stress. Additionally, if the training was a sudden increase in mechanical stress from what they were used to. For example, perfectly healthy people who get in really bad car accidents can develop rhabdo and kidney failure. Or if an unfit person attempted to run a marathon cold without proper training, etc.

There is no evidence that it is caused by creatine or protein intake, nor is there any reasonable physiologic rationale for such a theory. To this estrogen/pasta-eating queen telling your associate this, ask her to show him the data.


Those were my thoughts and comments to him also, but I wanted to make sure I was not missing something. My call: a few out of shape cops who tried out for SWAT and paid the price. If I hear back from him I will get more info.

erp7e
04-06-2005, 06:09 PM
Agreed (your call).