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Devildog
06-22-2003, 06:19 PM
Did anyone catch the fight last night? Lennox looked pretty flabby and unconditioned by boxing standards. He was lucky to get away with a win! I hope to see a rematch in the future.

Simon
06-23-2003, 08:35 AM
Originally posted by Devildog
Did anyone catch the fight last night? Lennox looked pretty flabby and unconditioned by boxing standards. He was lucky to get away with a win! I hope to see a rematch in the future.

Yah saw it, but didn't overly pay heed to his condition as he tends to be 20lbs over his top figting weight whenever he fights big guys. This is quite often standard practise with trainers, they figure that the extra power and bodyweight is more important if your fighting a guy where tieing him up may be a crucial element in the fight.

As it was it looked like Klit did the majority of the holding.

I think it's a shame it ended when it did, I think it was unfair for Klit, but it did look like Lewis was taking control IMO, he lost the early rounds but was taking control quiet nicely and busting the Ukraianian up , I think given 2 more rounds Lewis would have finished him properly.

Again, it shows that Lewis can be beaten, Klit had in in major trouble early on, but Lewis has shown he has good heart and suprisingly at times a good chin cos Klit can whack a bit.

All in all, apart from the ending a pretty damm satisying heavyweight fight, they really went at it by heavyweight standards.

Historically... Akinwande, Mcall and Rahman, anyone in a rematch with Lewis gets 10x the kicking he put up in the first fight.

Manny Steward will be going awol with Lewis for getting caught in the first fight, look for Lewis to come in leaner and be more dominant from rd1 in the rematch, I'll predict Lewis by KO in 4


Simon

Simon

Devildog
06-23-2003, 02:54 PM
It was good fight and a damn shame it had to end like that. You're right, Lennox looked to be getting the better of Vitaly in the last two rounds. Lennox does dominate in rematches, no doubt about that. But I don't think his increased weight was done on purpose. He didn't know he was fighting the Ukranian until two weeks before the fight. I think age and overall complacency are getting the best of him, especially since there really aren't any top contenders (until now).

Did you see that Tyson got arrested in Brooklyn b/c someone called him out? Gotta love New Yorkers!

Simon
06-23-2003, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by Devildog
It was good fight and a damn shame it had to end like that. You're right, Lennox looked to be getting the better of Vitaly in the last two rounds. Lennox does dominate in rematches, no doubt about that. But I don't think his increased weight was done on purpose. He didn't know he was fighting the Ukranian until two weeks before the fight. I think age and overall complacency are getting the best of him, especially since there really aren't any top contenders (until now).

Did you see that Tyson got arrested in Brooklyn b/c someone called him out? Gotta love New Yorkers!

Who did he think he was fighting before Klit became the option ?
Another heavy guy?

I'm not sure I buy complacency as a negative with Lewis, he's always shown me that he trains hard, prepares well, bar Rahman, and takes little for granted. If anything I would say Lewis is over cautious, over prepared at times, 18 weeks prep time sometimes apparently.

Perhaps your right but I guess we will see in the rematch and my bet is Klit gets KO'd in 4 rounds or less.

Simon

Devildog
06-24-2003, 12:00 AM
He was supposed to fight Kirk Johnson until he tore his pec muscle a few weeks before the fight. Johnson is only 6ft2 or thereabouts. Nothing like the 6ft7 Ukranian monster.

purple1184
06-24-2003, 01:56 PM
My opinion is Lewis was lucky to make it out of the second round. Thats too bad as self centered and arrogant as he was after the fight I hope the next time he fights he gets his ass kicked.

He was out of shape peroid. Sounds like it is starting to go to his head. He looked terrible. On the score cards Klit won the last two rounds so my opinion is he wasn't taking control. Even though Klit could only see with one eye. Lewis was completely exhausted I think Klit would have got him in the next couple of rounds. Too bad.

If there is a rematch (I doublt there will be Lewis won't risk it) Lewis probably does knock him out in 5. I wish he would fight Byrd. But I am sure he is too afraid. Did you see the news conference after the fight? Byrd called him out big time. Byrd was slamming him it was great.

Lewis is one of the biggest pricks in the fight game and that is saying something. He wouldn't give Vitali any credit after the fight. What a complete ass. Heres hopin he gets it handed to him the next time out.

surge
06-25-2003, 02:10 AM
Lewis-Klitchko....Boring

Gatti-Ward 3.....Now that was a fu...n boxing match. If they ever release some sort of video on that trilogy, I'm definatly buying!!!

Simon
06-25-2003, 09:54 AM
Originally posted by purple1184
My opinion is Lewis was lucky to make it out of the second round. Thats too bad as self centered and arrogant as he was after the fight I hope the next time he fights he gets his ass kicked.

Y**up, don't know about lucky, but he certainly looked bad to me, but seemed to come back easily in 3 and 4 and won both the rounds.

He was out of shape peroid. Sounds like it is starting to go to his head. He looked terrible.

**, didn't know he took a fight with essentially the no2 heavyweight in the world on 2 weeks notice, man, that's insane.


On the score cards Klit won the last two rounds so my opinion is he wasn't taking control. Even though Klit could only see with one eye. Lewis was completely exhausted I think Klit would have got him in the next couple of rounds. Too bad.

**We will never know, klit looked busted up badly , Lewis looked unmarked, It seemed to me like Lewis was doing better, but It's all conjecture.



If there is a rematch (I doublt there will be Lewis won't risk it)

**Lewis, has proven time after time, after time, he will always take the rematch even against guys who have knocked him out, so it's highly unlikely he won't fight on, his ego/pride will drive him to a rematch and properly prepared it wouldn't surprise me to see Klit beaten and Ko'd in 5 rouds or less.



Lewis probably does knock him out in 5. I wish he would fight Byrd. But I am sure he is too afraid. Did you see the news conference after the fight? Byrd called him out big time. Byrd was slamming him it was great.

**BYrd would be KO'd in 1-2 rounds, tops IMO, HBO is unlikely to pay for Byrd -Lewis, I wouldn't pay mega bucks for it, it's a crucification IMO. Byrd's a slick player but he has nothing that could come close to hurting Lewis and Lewis is technically proficent enough and swift enough to catch him within 6-8 minutes of ther match.

Lewis is one of the biggest pricks in the fight game and that is saying something.


**I guess it's personal opinon, I would say he carries himself prretty well, no drugs, no women beating, honours rematches, has never pulled out of a fight, never caused promoters a problem, apart from Eliades who tried to screw him.

All in all, a pretty decent fella, with the normal heavyweight chamption on the world ego


He wouldn't give Vitali any credit after the fight. What a complete ass.

**True, but that's one side of the coin, that was after Vitali said all the damage on his face was due to one headbutt not Lewis hitting him which was ludicrous.



Heres hopin he gets it handed to him the next time out.

** Possible, but unlikly, Lewis has proven time after time in rematches to be a dominant and fully prepared force, if was preparing for Kirk Johnson it doesn't surprise me he wasn't at full capacity, they are in different leagues IMO

Lewis biggerst mistake was taking on one of the Klits at 2 weeks notice, instead of pulling out, but had he pulled out everyone would have complained he was running, it's a no win for him.

I woudn't be surprised to see Klit out for the count in less than 5 rounds in the rematch and now the monies there for Lewis-Klit you can gurantee they will take it in a shot unless of course a no1 contender refused to be bought off.

Lewis has never run from competiion, in fact he's purposely made an effort to fight his nemesis.

Simes

Simon
06-25-2003, 09:57 AM
Originally posted by surge
Lewis-Klitchko....Boring

Gatti-Ward 3.....Now that was a fu...n boxing match. If they ever release some sort of video on that trilogy, I'm definatly buying!!!

Ayman to that, I wouldn't say boring, by heavyweigh standards that was a pretty decent scrap, I've seen a thousand worse, but compared to Gatti - Ward, well lets be honest, what else really manages to compares to that, Barrera-Morales I was hot, Ali -Frazier 1&2 was hot.

Simes

purple1184
06-25-2003, 01:53 PM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by purple1184
My opinion is Lewis was lucky to make it out of the second round. Thats too bad as self centered and arrogant as he was after the fight I hope the next time he fights he gets his ass kicked.

Y**up, don't know about lucky, but he certainly looked bad to me, but seemed to come back easily in 3 and 4 and won both the rounds.
-- Don't agree. Easily? Even the punch he cut his eye wasn't a good punch. If you watch the replay it was his thumb that scraped his eye and cut it.


On the score cards Klit won the last two rounds so my opinion is he wasn't taking control. Even though Klit could only see with one eye. Lewis was completely exhausted I think Klit would have got him in the next couple of rounds. Too bad.

**We will never know, klit looked busted up badly , Lewis looked unmarked, It seemed to me like Lewis was doing better, but It's all conjecture.
-- His eye was torn up but he looked like he was getting around better than lewis. Lewis was just looking for an excuse to fall. He was completely exhausted. How was he taking control towards the end of the fight? I didn't see it, what did you see?



If there is a rematch (I doublt there will be Lewis won't risk it)

**Lewis, has proven time after time, after time, he will always take the rematch even against guys who have knocked him out, so it's highly unlikely he won't fight on, his ego/pride will drive him to a rematch and properly prepared it wouldn't surprise me to see Klit beaten and Ko'd in 5 rouds or less.
-- If the money is there.


Lewis probably does knock him out in 5. I wish he would fight Byrd. But I am sure he is too afraid. Did you see the news conference after the fight? Byrd called him out big time. Byrd was slamming him it was great.

**BYrd would be KO'd in 1-2 rounds, tops IMO, HBO is unlikely to pay for Byrd -Lewis, I wouldn't pay mega bucks for it, it's a crucification IMO. Byrd's a slick player but he has nothing that could come close to hurting Lewis and Lewis is technically proficent enough and swift enough to catch him within 6-8 minutes of ther match.
-- If he comes into the match the same shape he was saturday he gets beat easy. Lewis's problem is he doesn't have a chin, if anyone catches him he is gone. Lewis is a the heavy weight champion when the heavy weight division is the weakest its been for a long, long time PERIOD!





Lewis is one of the biggest pricks in the fight game and that is saying something.


**I guess it's personal opinon, I would say he carries himself prretty well, no drugs, no women beating, honours rematches, has never pulled out of a fight, never caused promoters a problem, apart from Eliades who tried to screw him.

All in all, a pretty decent fella, with the normal heavyweight chamption on the world ego
-- You can be a prick without beating women, taking drugs, honoring rematches or never pulling out of a fight. And after the fight saturday I am pretty sure that is what the majority of the people watching saw.


He wouldn't give Vitali any credit after the fight. What a complete ass.

**True, but that's one side of the coin, that was after Vitali said all the damage on his face was due to one headbutt not Lewis hitting him which was ludicrous.
-- Lewis didn't hear this before he stuck his head up his ass making his comments and trying to take the mic from larry (what a class move that was). If he is such a man he should have had no problems with the questions he was being asked. But he couldn't handle it.



Heres hopin he gets it handed to him the next time out.

** Possible, but unlikly, Lewis has proven time after time in rematches to be a dominant and fully prepared force, if was preparing for Kirk Johnson it doesn't surprise me he wasn't at full capacity, they are in different leagues IMO

Lewis biggerst mistake was taking on one of the Klits at 2 weeks notice, instead of pulling out, but had he pulled out everyone would have complained he was running, it's a no win for him.

I woudn't be surprised to see Klit out for the count in less than 5 rounds in the rematch and now the monies there for Lewis-Klit you can gurantee they will take it in a shot unless of course a no1 contender refused to be bought off.

Lewis has never run from competiion, in fact he's purposely made an effort to fight his nemesis.

-- Lewis had never been and never will be a great heavy weight. Who has he beat that hasn't been over the hill or over hyped. And now he is over the hill. Saturday he looked like he was under the hill. If thats the best the heavy weight division has to offer its a sad day.

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Simon
06-25-2003, 02:02 PM
That's your opinion, your entitled to it. Lewis is a top 8 heavy in anybodies book and he's cleaned up every heavwyeught of his era, aside from Bowe who's team didtched the belt rather than face Lewis, but he beat at the Olympics.

It's easily to nullify the competition, well Tyson was old, yeah , so is Lewis, well Golota was sick, yeah sick from being whacked in the head, yeah, Grant was a puppy, yeah who even the likes of Katz rated over Lewis. Tyson struggeled to death with the likes of Ruddock, who Lewis KO'd without breaking a sweat. He beat the stuffing out of Holyfield in fight 1 who was being rated again after crucuifying Tyson who would supposedly thrash him. I could go and on and on re the comparisons and double standards.

You can argue all you want on Lewis, in my book and most unbiased experts view, he's a top 10 heavy. He's achieved other success unsurpassed aside by Ali in rematches, consistantly stepped up to the plate, and consistently improved under Steward.

In regards the scoring, you asked me what was I watching, I was simply quoting the refs scorecards which had Lewis winning rounds 3 and 4. Simple as that really.

In regards his little childish tantrum after the fight , compared to some heavies he's fricken angel, class is pretty irrelevant in the game of boxing when it comes to rating heavyweight abilities and rankings.

Most of the people who actually detract from Lewis accomplishements concurrently rated Tyson, who barely fought a live body in his entire carear (making huge payoffs to avoid Lewis). Who wouldn't fight Holyfield until HBO wanted their investment back, etc, etc and flat our refused anything to do with Bowe as well.


You can pick holes in all fighters, but IMO, Lewis has stepped up to the plate, beaten every single heavweight of note in his era, sometimes twice and that's all a guy can do, he's also technically far, far superior compared to the majority of heavies out there.

There's always a temptation to then say, well the division is bad, well I would disagree, the likes of Fraxier were just poor mans Holyfields, Ali was the only stand out heavy of his decade, and his toughest competiion was probably Foreman in terms of power who was a lumbering oaf compared to Lewis or Holmes who was the real talent of the era.

Nothing creates contraversy like boxing, especially heavyweight boxing, but there's a big tendancy to dum down the current crop to belittle the champs, if you look back over history it's been going since Dempsey

If you removed Lewis from the equation, people would never had said Tua was a nobody, people like Grant and Etienne and no hopers woudl be classifed as the tpo 5 and the Klits probably being hailed as great heavies. It's all perception

SIMES
Simes

purple1184
06-26-2003, 01:39 PM
Originally posted by SIMES
That's your opinion, your entitled to it. Lewis is a top 8 heavy in anybodies book and he's cleaned up every heavwyeught of his era, aside from Bowe who's team didtched the belt rather than face Lewis, but he beat at the Olympics.

It's easily to nullify the competition, well Tyson was old, yeah , so is Lewis, well Golota was sick, yeah sick from being whacked in the head, yeah, Grant was a puppy, yeah who even the likes of Katz rated over Lewis. Tyson struggeled to death with the likes of Ruddock, who Lewis KO'd without breaking a sweat. He beat the stuffing out of Holyfield in fight 1 who was being rated again after crucuifying Tyson who would supposedly thrash him. I could go and on and on re the comparisons and double standards.

You can argue all you want on Lewis, in my book and most unbiased experts view, he's a top 10 heavy. He's achieved other success unsurpassed aside by Ali in rematches, consistantly stepped up to the plate, and consistently improved under Steward.

In regards the scoring, you asked me what was I watching, I was simply quoting the refs scorecards which had Lewis winning rounds 3 and 4. Simple as that really.

In regards his little childish tantrum after the fight , compared to some heavies he's fricken angel, class is pretty irrelevant in the game of boxing when it comes to rating heavyweight abilities and rankings.

Most of the people who actually detract from Lewis accomplishements concurrently rated Tyson, who barely fought a live body in his entire carear (making huge payoffs to avoid Lewis). Who wouldn't fight Holyfield until HBO wanted their investment back, etc, etc and flat our refused anything to do with Bowe as well.


You can pick holes in all fighters, but IMO, Lewis has stepped up to the plate, beaten every single heavweight of note in his era, sometimes twice and that's all a guy can do, he's also technically far, far superior compared to the majority of heavies out there.

There's always a temptation to then say, well the division is bad, well I would disagree, the likes of Fraxier were just poor mans Holyfields, Ali was the only stand out heavy of his decade, and his toughest competiion was probably Foreman in terms of power who was a lumbering oaf compared to Lewis or Holmes who was the real talent of the era.

Nothing creates contraversy like boxing, especially heavyweight boxing, but there's a big tendancy to dum down the current crop to belittle the champs, if you look back over history it's been going since Dempsey

If you removed Lewis from the equation, people would never had said Tua was a nobody, people like Grant and Etienne and no hopers woudl be classifed as the tpo 5 and the Klits probably being hailed as great heavies. It's all perception

SIMES
Simes

Let me just sum this up so we don't get into a little cat fight. We obviously each have our own opinion on the matter. Enough said.

Simon
06-26-2003, 01:51 PM
Originally posted by purple1184
Let me just sum this up so we don't get into a little cat fight. We obviously each have our own opinion on the matter. Enough said.

Agreed, entirely, as I said, I don't believe their is a sport out there that creates quite such differing opinions or quite often the sheer level of transient opionions that heavyweight boxing and boxing in general does.

That said, I don't think a difference of opinion is a bad thing, many people share your POV, many share mine, who's right per se? Almost impossible to tell as the sport is subjective at best.

A bit of cat fight now and then though is fine as long as people like you are around because the whole thing stays sane.

My two cents...

Regards

Simon